Sole Grinds on Wedges
Because EIDOLON’s makes a big deal out of our patented V-SOLE (and it warrants the attention), we get lots of questions on the subject, and it has been no different here. So I thought I would choose one of those readers at random and address the topic in some detail today. So, the lucky WedgeGuy reader who will be getting a FREE EIDOLON V-SOLE wedge is Agustin Rodriguez of Guadalajara, Mexico. He asked specifically:
“Can you explain the difference between the Cleveland Dynamic Sole Grind (DSG) and Eidolon's patented V-Sole?
Well, Agustin, let me start by addressing the basics. Essentially, you’ll see wedges on the racks in the stores that fall into three basic categories – low, high and “tour” bounce.
The industry says that you should select a low bounce wedge for tight lies and firm turf, or if you have a shallow angle of attack. They say you should opt for a high bounce wedge for sand, soft turf or if you have a steep angle of attack.
So let’s dissect that first.
Every golf course I’ve ever played had both firm and soft turf, sand and bunkers, and changed from day to day depending on whether it rained or not. Guys, I just can’t make sense out of that advice from the major brands. Don’t those guys play golf????
Secondly, if you are going to have any kind of short game at all, you have to change your angle of attack from shot to shot. A low pitch with minimal spin requires a shallow clubhead path. A high soft lob requires a steep path.
And then there’s the “tour grind”. I’ve always said there are three tests as to whether you are ready for that:
1. Does your course superintendent go out and water your bunkers every morning so they will be nice and firm? (The tour does.)Guys, please trust me on this. “Tour grind” wedges are made specifically for the skill set that only belongs to the top handful of golfers in the world; who practice more in a week than you will in a year or lifetime; and who play on the most carefully-manicured courses imaginable. You don’t need a tour bounce wedge any more than you need Danica Patrick’s Indy car!
Then there are those “other” sole designs.
The Cleveland DSG features a very aggressive bounce on a very narrow sole. The back portion has a severe upward angle (negative bounce) so doesn’t make contact with the turf at all. Ping had this very design in the 1980s and discontinued it.
The Solus wedge has a channel in the sole which really doesn’t change the performance that much from our testing.
There are many wedges with “knocked off” heel and toe areas, but you’re approaching that “tour bounce” thing I discussed. That is designed to reduce bounce when you lay the face open – the whole reason to lay the face open is to increase your effective bounce!
So, you have lots of choices, and we think EIDOLON beats them all. But maybe you want to try them to see for yourself. That’s why we offer the industry’s boldest guarantee – if you don’t like the EIDOLON, send it back and we’ll buy you any other wedge you think you’d like better!
Those other guys won’t do that!
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"You donGÇÖt need a tour bounce wedge any more than you need Danica PatrickGÇÖs Indy car!"- I agree I don't need a tour bounce wedge. I strong DISAGREE that I don't need an Indy car. That would be SWEEETT!
Perhaps I missed it, but you didn't explain how the EIDOLON wedge differs. You just said why I don't need a low bounce, high bounce, or tour grind. So what does EIDOLON do that is different than that?
I agree with AbsoluteZero. from what i'm seeing, there isn't much of a difference from the Eidolon wedge when compared to the Cleveland 588 besides yours having half as much bounce. so how does your 56 degree wedge (with 7 degrees of bounce) differ than the Bob Vokey Titleist 56 degree wedge (with 8 degrees of bounce)?
I always hesitate to get into too much "sales pitch" on here guys, but since you asked . . .
There is a huge difference between the patented EIDOLON V-SOLE and the 588 or any other. What our technology does is combine a very aggressive bounce in the leading 1/4" of the sole, with a very low bounce main portion. This allows the wedges to perform from tight lies while still having the characteristics that make them excellent from bunkers and soft turf, where more bounce is needed. They are the only wedges that can do this. I direct you to a couple of pages on the EIDOLON site that give more detail. www.eidolongolf.com/vsole.asp and www.eidolongolf.com/bounce.asp.
Tim Horan says:
Knowing that you were involved with the Ray Cook/ Reid Lockhart design houses how do the Ray Cook dual bounce wedges compare to your own?
So, how does a golfer utilize the two different bounces on the Eidolon wedge? Is it a differnt swing, angle of attack?
The real trick is finding a wedge that suits your game. Off the rack "tour grinds" are silly because most of those guys are playing custom wedges where either they or someone else make those changes day to day or week to week. So one week they might want a leading edge grind with more bounce on the trailing edge, other weeks they might go for a sharper leading edge and almost no bounce on the trailing edge.
I find that over time and use(especially in bunkers) wedges will "grind themselves" to your swing so I always keep my older ones around as a reference point when I'm picking out a new wedge. Obviously if my old wedge(that I like) has worn away the leading edge, picking up a new one with a sharp leading edge will be a major mistake. Same thing goes with the heel and the trailing edge, on an unground wedge I wear the heck out the heels because I like to change the loft/bounce to play different shots around the green.
The best example I can think of is how a chisel works - a beveled one. The sole of the club acts like the chisel bevel - controlling the aggressiveness of the cut. The steeper you hold the chisel the more easily it will dive - for chunking out large pieces. For gently shaving the wood, a long bevel (sole) stabalizes cutting like a plane wood. What's neat about this is the way the grain of the grass and wood have similar grabby qualities.
I think you can utilize the front bounce of Eid wedges by moving the ball position back (or hands forward) to steepen the club face loft. The front portion of the sole will "fit" to the ground better and dig because the big dumb sole is now airborne.
Center or forward ball position lays the big clunky sole down to resist the burrowing of the club.
The two bounces on the EIDOLON V-SOLE wedges always are working together, actually. The aggressive leading bounce prevents the leading edge from digging in, for example. On short pitches and chips, the little "ridge" in the sole acts as a kind of intermediate trailing edge to help get the club out of the turf when clubhead speed is reduced. When you lay the face open, the two angles work together to let you "dial in" just the bounce you need, from low to high.
I will refrain from too much comment on my former company except to say that the pricing pretty much tells you the kind of quality they now deliver, I'm sad to say.
Terry: Did you ever look at the sole configuration of the Wilson R-20 Sarazen, Special Wedge? Quite interesting don't you think and it has worked quite well for a long long time (Regripped Twice). I may have to try one of your lower loft wedges to see how it compares to that "jewel". JWHpurist
I have and play a PGA R91 wedge I got the club new in 1976 or 1977 I believe, can anyone tell me what the bounce spec is on this club?
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