bkuehn1952 wrote:

Note the word "occasionally" in the citation from the USGA Handicap Manual. If one applied all the modified rules to a round of golf, that seems to me to go beyond "occasionally" and becomes closer to "always".

Just because someone plans to follow some of the Modified Rules of Golf does not mean every situation occurs on every round, except maybe gimmies and playing winter rules (both of which are specifically approved by the USGA for posting for their handicap). If a golfer does not hit OB, does not loose a ball and is able to get out of the sand on their first try, I think you are rather arrogant to tell them they are not playing "real golf" because they intended to lift out of the sand if they could not get out on their first try.

GrampaB70 wrote:

Just because someone plans to follow some of the Modified Rules of Golf does not mean every situation occurs on every round, except maybe gimmies and playing winter rules (both of which are specifically approved by the USGA for posting for their handicap). If a golfer does not hit OB, does not lose a ball and is able to get out of the sand on their first try, I think you are rather arrogant to tell them they are not playing "real golf" because they intended to lift out of the sand if they could not get out on their first try.

I do not recall using the term "real golf". I play golf. Others play modified golf. They are not the same game.

While I tend to agree with bkeuhn, I don't think that this is worth getting into a pissing match over. I play golf as close to the rules as I know how, but I don't dictate how others play unless I'm in a competition with them. Interestingly, one of the reasons I shy away from competitions is simply because of the fact that most (all?) of the competitions I have played in don't take the rules seriously at all. I could conceivably call a rules violation (or two) on every hole.

I fully condone people playing the game however they feel it is the most fun. If someone I am paired up with mentions rules during the round, I will bring up rules as well. Otherwise, I tend to keep my mouth shut.

Bryan K wrote:

I fully condone people playing the game however they feel it is the most fun. If someone I am paired up with mentions rules during the round, I will bring up rules as well. Otherwise, I tend to keep my mouth shut.

Bryan I think I could enjoy a casual round of golf with you. It would be nice to be able to get good answers to rules questions and not be belittled if I elected not to follow all of the rules during a round of casual golf.

My sister in law is a 3 hdcp and has played competitive golf thru high school, college, USArmy and many state competitions as an amateur for over 25 yrs. She is pretty darn good.

Years ago we were playing down at Cherry Point, NC and my tee shot came to rest in a little ditchline off the fairway so I moved it to have a swing. At the time I was around a 90-100 shooter but had just started keeping stats. Didn't know much about rules.

Anyway, I moved it and the only thing she said was " oh, you're that kind of golfer".

I have NEVER forgotten it.

CeeBee wrote:

Anyway, I moved it and the only thing she said was " oh, you're that kind of golfer".

Well she would not be welcome in any casual round of golf I have. As far as I am concerned she can golf anyway she wants. And so can I on a casual day of golf.

If the only golfers allowed on a golf course were those who play by all the Rules of Golf all the time we surely would not have any difficulty getting a tee time. Most courses would be almost empty until they closed down.

Here is how the Modified Rules of Golf can work. Any set of modified rules will work. The Modified Rules of Golf is a sample and a checklist. But it does say what to expect.

Since I feel that I am golfing following the principles of the Rules of Golf I am required to post my scores to my GHIN account and maintain my USGA Handicap Index. I recognize and accept that my Index is a point or 2 lower than it would be if I followed all of the Rules of Golf. I am OK with that but my Index does reflect my potential when I use the Modified Rules.

I play with a friend who has an Index of 2. He follows all the Rules of Golf. My Index is much higher using the Modified Rules. He uses the Blue Tees and I use the Gold Tees. I give up 6 or 7 stokes off my handicap because of the Rating difference. We bet on every round. We have been passing that same amount back and forth for months. He never complains that I don't follow all the rules since he knows what to expect. The competition is fair since we take turns winning. I enjoy golfing with him and he makes me feel he enjoys golfing with me.

CeeBee wrote:

My sister in law is a 3 hdcp and has played competitive golf thru high school, college, USArmy and many state competitions as an amateur for over 25 yrs. She is pretty darn good. Years ago we were playing down at Cherry Point, NC and my tee shot came to rest in a little ditchline off the fairway so I moved it to have a swing. At the time I was around a 90-100 shooter but had just started keeping stats. Didn't know much about rules. Anyway, I moved it and the only thing she said was " oh, you're that kind of golfer". I have NEVER forgotten it.

I had a similar encounter back in the '90's. It's one of the things that drove me away from the game, to be honest. Someone called me a dishonest golfer, and that, coupled with my temper, made me feel completely worthless on the golf course.

I swore I'd never do that to anyone else. Golf is a hard enough game the way it is. It doesn't help to make people feel inadequate by bringing up every rule in fraction (or any rule infraction). However, I do have a modicum of respect for people who break some golf rules, admit they break some golf rules, and then say that they are playing just to have fun competing with themselves. It sure beats the players who pretend to take golf seriously but break rules and then proceed to brag about their scores. Yeah, I shot an eagle last year. I took the putt three times, though, so it doesn't count.

GrampaB70 wrote:

Bryan K wrote: I fully condone people playing the game however they feel it is the most fun. If someone I am paired up with mentions rules during the round, I will bring up rules as well. Otherwise, I tend to keep my mouth shut. Bryan I think I could enjoy a casual round of golf with you. It would be nice to be able to get good answers to rules questions and not be belittled if I elected not to follow all of the rules during a round of casual golf.

Hey. I'm going to engage in some playful ribbing from time to time. (Dude, you're only allowed three mulligans per hole. I gotta put my foot down here). Just last week, I played with a bloke who borrowed his friend's club for a shot. Since we were playfully ribbing each other all round long, I told him "that's a penalty, you know." And his response was "Yeah, but I'm not keeping score".

That's a foreign thought to me. How can one play golf without keeping score?

But to each his own. A score means different things to different people. To this bloke, his round was dictated by the fact that he had two birdies, one of them legitimate. And that's why he played.

If you're gonna modify the rules at least keep it to yourself for God's sake man.

In 1974 I played a round at St.Andrews with a 3 handicap at Firestone. For some reason he rolled the ball over on the 1st fairway. His caddie dropped his bag, said i dinna carry for cheaters and walked off the course. He had to return to the tee and beg for another caddy. Point. Some people are very serious about the rules. Others not so much.

CeeBee wrote:

My sister in law is a 3 hdcp and has played competitive golf thru high school, college, USArmy and many state competitions as an amateur for over 25 yrs. She is pretty darn good. Years ago we were playing down at Cherry Point, NC and my tee shot came to rest in a little ditchline off the fairway so I moved it to have a swing. At the time I was around a 90-100 shooter but had just started keeping stats. Didn't know much about rules. Anyway, I moved it and the only thing she said was " oh, you're that kind of golfer". I have NEVER forgotten it.

This is a very good point. CeeBee is a fine golfer and most ppl would kill to have that kind of game. See I don't think one can ever hope to play well until he accepts the rules and stops catering to his weakness. I agree totally that fun is the name of the game but I would bet that someone like CeeBee gets way more enjoyment out of his golf than someone who modifies the rules to make himself feel better in the short term. That's ironic I know but life is ful of ironies. A two wheel bike is more fun to ride than one with training wheels even though you expose yourself to gravity and the possibility of falling over.

You can play golf by the rules and still have fun, you just don't put so much stock in the scores you make. Or better yet move up to the shortest tees, what a beautifully elegant and dignified way to give yourself a chance at lower scores.

legitimatebeef wrote:

Or better yet move up to the shortest tees, what a beautifully elegant and dignified way to give yourself a chance at lower scores.

I agree with you on this more than 100% if that is possible. But think about it a minute. Men can use the typical Blue Tees or move forward to the White Tees or move forward to the Gold Tees. Seems almost everyone considers the Red Tees the Ladies Tees so moving up to there is unlikely for most men. Some courses do not even have the Red Tees Rated for men.

But what choices do ladies have? They get to use the Red Tees or the Red Tees or the Red Tees. Does that seem fair? Seems most courses don't care that much about lady golfers anyway.

A few courses are adding another set of Forward Tees in front of the Red Tees and they are Rated for both men and ladies. On those courses all golfers are ablt to Tee it Forward.

Holy Cow!!!! The rules nuts are all stirred up. Loosen up. No one is trying to impose new rules on everyone. All Ed is saying is, there are a lot of people playing golf that are not having a good time on the course. Come on folks. Please admit that there are a lot of players that never had a chance to win The U S Open and they never will. Why beat a dead horse. The game is humbling enough to impose additional pressures. If you play completely by the rules good for you. If not this is a viable option.

Some people are rules snobs.

I'm a coffee snob.

To each his or her own.